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Will cuts to lights leave us in dark? - ballot

11:30am Friday 10th February 2012 in News

Will cuts to lights leave us in dark? - ballot Will cuts to lights leave us in dark? - ballot

TOWNS and villages across Worcestershire could be plunged into darkness if street lights are switched off at night to save a cash-strapped council money.

Such a move has caused controversy elsewhere in the country, such as when a 19-year-old soldier died in Somerset in a road accident on Christmas Day – his family believe the council’s decision to turn the lights off overnight was a factor in his death.

Worcestershire County Council spends about £2 million a year on energy bills for the 60,000 street lights it is responsible for but bosses are urging departments to cut costs in a bid to slash up to £70 million from the budget by 2015 as a result of reduced government funding.

While options to save £500,000 include making lights more energy-efficient – as well as dimming them at certain times – John Smith, cabinet member for highways and transport, believes the LED atechnology is not yet cost effective and reliable enough.

As a result, transport chiefs are considering switching some lights off either at set times, such as between midnight and 5.30am, or permanently.

At a meeting of the Conservative-controlled cabinet yesterday, Councillor Simon Geraghty, in charge of planning, economy and performance, said: “This is not simply about turning off swathes of street lights. It’s about looking at individual circumstances.”

But Councillor Liz Eyre, cabinet member for children and young people’s social care, said: “This is a very tricky issue.”

Councillor Marcus Hart, cabinet member for health and well-being, admitted there are “important safety issues” but added he was confident Coun Smith and his team would make the right decisions.

Councillor Fran Oborski, a Liberal, said she thought members might be quite surprised at how many rural and urban areas will want lights switched off and Trish Haines, the council’s chief executive, agreed when she said: “Quite a lot of people think street lighting is a total waste of money.

"But while some will be pleased some will be very upset about it.”

A scrutiny committee will now look at the matter and report back in a year.

Comments(20)

CJH says...
11:35am Fri 10 Feb 12

Don't people have headlights on their cars?

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Red Baron says...
11:59am Fri 10 Feb 12

In these days of the "caring for the environment" and cost-cutting culture, why do we spend money on so many street lights.
If every other one was turned off there would still be enough light to see by. The M5 has had new lighting of the more effective "peach" coloured type and when the Highways people were fitting the new lights (between Droitwich and Worcester) there were times when every alternate light was turned off. You could still see enough to drive.
The "sodium" street lights that give off a orange glow, are very inefficient as a good proportion of their light goes up or sideways. Look into the night sky and you will see the towns light glowing
against any clouds. The newer peach coloured light are far more efficient.

If you want more information see the Campaign for Dark Skies web site.

If you want to go out in the dark - buy a torch!!

Keep the night skies dark and get the councils to stop wasting our money on lighting that isn't needed or required.

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Ctrl Alt Del says...
12:26pm Fri 10 Feb 12

Will you be in the dark if they turn the lights out? I expect so, probably.

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CDH says...
1:23pm Fri 10 Feb 12

Would turning off the street lights make life easier for our less honest members of the comunity !

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pudniw_gib says...
2:20pm Fri 10 Feb 12

Wouldnt make much difference to crime levels, they wouldn't be able to see either....
Seriously though, we have too much light at night, we need darkness for our health. The production of melatonin in the body requires darkness and most people in towns don't get any due to the street lights.
http://abcnews.go.co
m/Health/story?id=11
7447&page=1

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induby says...
2:29pm Fri 10 Feb 12

i think that's a really good idea!!!!!! , i mean its got some niggles that would need to be worked out, and i'm sure there are areas that are not eligible but there is definitely potential there and room to compromise too,
at the very least it might be worth giving it a trial run ,
but i do have to say after reading the pay/wages report for staff at a more senior level at the council , i think that there are definitely some other areas that could save money!!!!

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The Moan says...
3:29pm Fri 10 Feb 12

CDH wrote:
Would turning off the street lights make life easier for our less honest members of the comunity !
I agree, the cover of darkness will be a great aid for robbing!!!! or worse.

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Emma Lou says...
6:45pm Fri 10 Feb 12

The only reason they think we don't need lights in the "wee small hours", is because they assume everyone will be asleep. They forget about people working night shifts, split shifts and the like. If it doesn't fall into a 9-5 time slot, it doesn't count, apparently.

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induby says...
8:00pm Fri 10 Feb 12

i dont think thats the case, its common sense that there are still going to be people around no matter what hour it is, but it is a fact that it is a much smaller amount of people and in weighing up costs, is it really necessary to have all the lights on costings thousands and thousands of pounds for such a very small number of people???? maybe the answer is to turn every other light off effectively switching off half the lights ???and that way meet in the middle!!!!

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Brer fox says...
8:45pm Fri 10 Feb 12

If you turn off the lights you make the roads more dangerous for all users and you make it easier for criminals to operate.Instead of causing danger on the roads save taxpayers money elsewhere..You could cut down on translation fees by making the people who need translators pay for them.You could save on the cost of printing documents and other council bumph by only printing them in engliish.You could cut councillors expenses to the level of the lowest paid council employee.And you could cut management pay down to a sustainable level.You could.But you wont.

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Red Baron says...
9:12am Sat 11 Feb 12

Could I suggest that instead of writing opinion that our correspondents actually vsisit the Campaign for Dark Skies web site .(http://www.britast
ro.org/dark-skies/in
dex.html)
and read the research that has been done, since 1989, on this subject.

* Crime does not go up when street lighting is taken away - quite the reverse.
* There are many miles of road, and that includes long sections of motorway, where there are no lights at all and yet motorists manage to drive along them at night. They are not accident "black" spots either.
* Too much light and therefore energy, is spent lighting the sky and not the areas where it is needed. This costs us all money through higher energy bills etc. The green pound affect.
* It is not only street lighting that causes problems. The inappropriate siting of security lighting has resulted in accidents.

We need to be able to define night as night and day as day. Our bodies need that distinction in order to rest and recover.
Remember that we do not have to remove all lighting. We need to ensure that what lighting there is is appropriate, it does the job it is installed to do and is of the correct type to save energy.

We do not all live in cities or large towns and yet country folk seem to survive without street lighting. It is surprising just how much light there is in the sky even when the moon is not present.

Be sensible and not too radical and all can be achieved.

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Brer fox says...
1:22pm Sat 11 Feb 12

Can I suggest that you try working at night instead of just wittering on about switching street lights off.It is a simple fact that it is far safer to drive on lit roads rather than unlit roads.You are far more aware of the road and its surroundings as well as being able to see people who do not wear light or reflective clothing.That includes cyclists who are too dumb to realise that a hi viz jacket could save their lives.This is the fact and not the theory.

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Brer fox says...
3:53pm Sat 11 Feb 12

I don't know if you have ever driven on an unlit motorway at night.The level of strain imposed is far higher than a lit motorway.Oncoming headlights dazzle you and that's not just from foreign vehicles.Some drivers forget to turn their headlights from main beam to dip beam.Some headlights are so badly adjusted that they shine straight at you..When you get to a lit section of motorway you breathe a sigh of relief.You know your level of danger has decreased.
And then there are the A ,B and other minor roads.Travelling on them is again safer when they are lit.If you work as a delivery driver it is easier to read road signs and road names and thus safer.
If you really want to save the planet grow fewer people.

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Red Baron says...
7:50pm Sat 11 Feb 12

Brer Fox,
Just to answer an number of points.
Yes, I have driven on unlit motorways and other roads around the UK at night on more occasions than I could remember.
I have driven well over 1 million miles in my driving career, in all weathers and at all times of the day and night and not just in cars but vans, motor-cycles and others.
Yes, I have worked night shifts and continue to work into the night in my present employ.

Common sense obviously seems to be lacking in drivers who do not dip - Remember the Dept of Transport "Dip don't Dazzle" campaign.
Pedestrians know where they should be - on the pavements and not on the road unless they do their "Green Cross Code" when they want to cross.

Cyclists should ensure that their bikes are lit at night in accordance with the Road Traffic Acts and not expect drivers to be able to see them. perhaps a few prosecutions would ensure that ccyclists conform to the law.

I am not advocating a complete ban on lights. Read my words accurately and you will read that I suggest that the right lights in the right place are what are needed.

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Brer fox says...
8:20pm Sat 11 Feb 12

Maybe I am more cynical than you? I know pedestrians will walk in the road.I know cyclists ignore the highway code.Everyday I see cars and other vehicles that have one or more lights out.I would have every motorway lit at night.That would save lives.I have not counted the miles i have driven.I know I average around 2000 a week.Some weeks more.Some less. I drive on the highways and byways at all times of the day and night.I know lighted roads are safer.More efficiant lighting would safe power but do not risk lives by turning the **** things off.

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Jabbadad says...
1:44am Mon 13 Feb 12

I agree with Brer fox, the M5 past Droitwich has the lights turned off after a certain time, and I recently had to go to the Airport at 3am and it became quite foggy particularly nearer to Birmingham, and it was definitely worst on the unlit parts where as said cars coming towards you had lights on full beam, and even the lorries creeping up behind were causing blind spots, and uncertainty. When I once again came onto the lit part of the Motorway it was definitely safer. And of course we all pay towards the cost of the street and Motorway lighting by one taxation or another, and I don't get a rebate for going to bed early and not being outside using street lights etc.
And aren't those who have to walk home after the buses stop running entitled to the same safety as others who drive?

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High Time says...
10:36am Mon 13 Feb 12

The Moan wrote:
CDH wrote: Would turning off the street lights make life easier for our less honest members of the comunity !
I agree, the cover of darkness will be a great aid for robbing!!!! or worse.
What about all the day time break ins they don't need street lights for them.

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induby says...
4:56pm Tue 14 Feb 12

like I said before there are definitely other areas that the council could save money, but I'm sure there must be areas around Worcester that really don't need to be lit all night long??? or at least could have every other light turned off, I for one don't think it would make that much of a difference on the M5 if every other light was turned off, especially if on the opposite side of the motorway they did the same but in alternate lights so at least in the spaces where the lights are off there was some light cast from the other sides of the motorway??? maybe lighting around residential areas (not roads but pathways in housing estates or parks the lighting could be made movement sensitive and come on when people need them, and not just blaring to themselves all night for nothing, and as for crime people get raped ,murdered, burgled, mugged, assaulted day and night, light or dark , its sad but true

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Vox populi says...
11:06pm Tue 14 Feb 12

Erm if you can't drive at night using your headlights why are you on the road?!? It's a requirement along with a standard of eyesight!

While you point towards the fact it may increase the risk of collision due to incompetence of road users it may also conversely decrease the risk of collision by increasing driver concentration. Could just be a case of drivers switched off when lights are switched on versus drivers switched on when lights are switched off.

Of course without analysis neither can be proved.

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MJI says...
2:47pm Thu 16 Feb 12

I would love to be able to see the night sky, I only properly see it when on holiday.

Also did you know that at night there is enough light from stars and the moon to see where you are going, full moon is great for walking.

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